new format for 2011/12

the idea to play the jathros league in a different format (groups, amount of frames) this season or is it fine the way it is ?

how would you like the jathros league to be played

1 what ever amout of groups depending on amount of players entered , with a max of 6 players in each group, the way it is just now , the players who make it to semi-finals to share all the prize money
- if their is more entered this year then the extra money would go to quarter-final losers
All the players who enter have a chance to win the title

2 division 1 and the winner to win the cup and a selection of prize money from this group, runner-up coming from this group of players and a prize money selection from this group of players, divsion 2 winner and runner-up from this group of players, division 3 winner and runner-up , their would be promotion and relegation from the groups
Only the winners of Division 1 can win the title

3 you got me voting but i dinni want to play in this competition

4 the handicap rating was just an example
agreed it might be fairer looking at lowering it
A class players nett
B class players +1
C class players +2
Don't think it would take too much to categorize each player.
Wouldn't expect more than a couple falling in between classes.


ok looking to start this maybe by october , as before £10 entry to be payed before the draw is made
groups of six depending on amount of players to decide how many groups

stoo £10 payed

Why not try runnin this in actual league format say 3 divisions of 10 players.

Premier.- best of 15 / Div 1.- best of 11 / Div 2.best of 7 Adjust entry and prize money accordingly.
Promotion/Relegation for following seasons

here are my toughts;
just sayin theres 30 entries

3 divisions - 10 in each division
players are seeded in to divisions from last years positions and results
1st division - £15 entry
2nd division - £10 entry
3rd division - £5 entry

promotion and relegation - top 2 from 2nd and 3rd divisions get promoted to divisions above
bottom 2 from 1st and 2nd divisions get relegated to divisions below
or can make it more interesting and send 3 up and down

format - play everyone in your division twice (or play everyone once then do a split and play everyone in your half once or twice)
2 points for a win and 1 point ( could make it more interesting and play 3 points for a win, 1 point for a draw and play a deciding frame to see who gets an extra point)
8 or 10 frames ( more frames are always better, gives people a bit more time to get a game going)

with the divisions bigger than what groups have been in the past it keeps people in with a chance and interested, when you get off to a bad start in short groups its hard to recover, big groups give you a chance to recover after a bad couple of games.

all suggestions are for to trying keep things fair for all players and keep people interested, you dont want people gettin beat 6-0 every week, its no good for them and they lose interest, if we do it this way then people should be playing against people of there standard and gives them something to work on by trying to get promoted and playing better players for better money, and doing 3 divisions would give everyone a chance of winning, 2nd and 3rd might not be much money but least they would be in a chance of winning it rather gettin thrashed every week against better players for nothing.

let me know what yous think

MEATHEAD

ok thanks for the ideas chaps

a couple of questions - who plays in the 1st 2nd 3rd division, how is this decided people will complain their not in a higher group "i am as good as him and im in group 3, oh im no playing"
in the league teams wont start in division 2 from the start because teams see their self as better than they are

we have 1 jathros title (trophy) so only the winners of divsion 1 will compete for the title ?

the way it is just now everyone gets a chance to play their group and then the best in the other groups overall (group winners) in the knock out

after it went to the knock-out stage after the groups
last years winner got £150 (winner group A)
runner up £80 (runner-up group A)
losing semi finalists £30 (winner and runner-up from group C)
winners and runner-up from groups B,D got nothing (lost Quarters)

the idea of semi-finals getting a prize was so the top two prizes was capped , some said it should have been all given to the winner , i would rather have more prizes for players than giving it all to a couple of players

your idea would give a prize for winning the group
div 1 £150 with no runner-up or £100 , £50
Div 2 £100 with no runner-up or £80 , £20
div 3 £50 with no runner-up or £40 , £10

frames per match upto 8 or 10 , your taking more time on the table in the pub some landlords wont be happy on a friday or saturday night if your hogging the table for so long, you are getting the table for free hopefully, some people are chuffed to get 3 frames (a draw) of the super starts of the league

it may sound like im against your ideas, but im just asking what about the question from the other side
of course if their is enough people ok with playing in division 2 or 3 then it may work

1. people who play in 1st,2nd and 3rd division will prob be chosen by you, go through your results and place finishes from llast few years and that will determine who enters what division, obviously new players will just be with your choice of judgement and trust me no one is gonna moan about there not in a higher division cause then they will have achance of winnin some money in lower divisions.

2. keep the trophy for the first division, sounds harsh but thats why it would be called first divion,

only pay out to winners and runners up

3. frames is up to, a just always wanna play more frames, its a pain in the ass travellin to a pub for 6 frames of pool

4. am sure people in division 2 and 3 would enjoy playin people of there own standard than gettin hammered by baba and deek 6-0 all the time.

another couple of questions

it is still harsh putting players in a lower group with no chance to play better players (you learn of better players as well as getting thumped) or winning the main prize

if someone has to select who plays in what group why not make it like the touring cars top drivers from the 1st race end up last in the next
so all the top players would start in group 3 and make their way to division 1 , I canny see this idea going down well with the players that think they can win it , but i feel i had to say the idea

me personally i would be happy to start in group 2 or 3 but if i won or was runner-up in the group would still like a shot at the title as well for that season (I know this idea would be the same as it is now)
but with all the prize money going to the group winners and runner-up their would be no prize money for this idea , I suppose it would not work as it would be easier to win 2 or 3 and be like being plymouth versus man utd in the final

stoo a see what your sayin but if you ask about am sure people would prefer to play people there own level, if they think there good enough to play 1st division then prove it by gettin promoted. yi get a guy put in a group with deek, baba and ian murray, he gets hammered 3 times hes no wanna play again, theres pullouts every year cause people get thumped first couple of games and have nothing to play for.

if your were struggling to pick the players to put in to the divisions give me a shout and ill help u do it cause i would just be honest.

a know what your meanin when your pickin up on points stoo, but am just lookin at makin it fairer and keepin people interested

Just voted for it to remain as is

Never played in the event before, but the current format looks ok to me.
On the night there is always the chance a few players could cause an upset (catching a so called better player having an off night).

That's the beauty of the cup !! so they say on the T.V.

most of the lesser players dont want to play the bigger players, they think its just a waste of money

If it's all about creating a level playing field, the only way to do it would be to handicap they players.

This would probably generate a greater number of players wanting to play?

Example
A class players Baba, Deek, Ian M, etc..... Top players of Auld Hoose, Brig etc
B class players Stoo etc...... Top players of Den Inn, Buck, Sunbeam etc
C class players Myself etc..... Players at the lower end.

each player who enters will fall into one of these classes.

sections are drawn containing 6 / 8 players
matches consist of 6 frames

A class player against a C class player (C class player starts on 3 frames).
A class player against a B class player (B class player starts on 2 frames).
B class player against a C class layer (C class player starts on 1 frame).

2 points for a win.
1 point for a draw.

Top player goes through to knockout.


The A class players will need to play very well to win their match or go through.
All the other players will have a chance to stay in the competiton longer.

i like that idea but between and `A` player and a `B` player is a thin line, giving them frames could be a bit unfair..

and it comes back to catagerisin players `A`, `B` and `C`

the handicap rating was just an example

agreed it might be fairer looking at lowering it

A class players nett
B class players +1
C class players +2

Don't think it would take too much to categorize each player.
Wouldn't expect more than a couple falling in between classes.

a just think it would be better if everyone played there own standard, players lose interest when there gettin hammered from better players

CAM wrote:the handicap rating was just an example

agreed it might be fairer looking at lowering it

A class players nett
B class players +1
C class players +2

Don't think it would take too much to categorize each player.
Wouldn't expect more than a couple falling in between classes.

CAM bit of a golfer are you , I like your idea never seen this idea for pool before

Luv the golf Stoo, can't play it for toffee though!!

I agree with your comments above, lesser players do learn more playing the top players.

I think everybody including the top players would like a competative cup competition.
These boy's must get bored as well turning up knowing they are going to whitewash a C class player.

Meathead is right in that the C class players won't pay their money to turn up for that.
Handicapping will give both players something to think about.

The A class player will feel the pressure right from the start knowing he cant afford to throw away a cheap frame, gotta be good for their game knowing they have to stay focused right from the start.
The C class player knows if he goes a couple of frames down he still has a chance to pinch a draw.

it would make for good interesting matches and also give the lesser players a chance to improve their game playing the top boys, should benefit the league play all round.

Damn I've even talked myeslf into supporting this format and I've already voted for it to remain as is !!!!

CAM wrote:If it's all about creating a level playing field, the only way to do it would be to handicap they players.

This would probably generate a greater number of players wanting to play?

Example
A class players Baba, Deek, Ian M, etc..... Top players of Auld Hoose, Brig etc
B class players Stoo etc...... Top players of Den Inn, Buck, Sunbeam etc
C class players Myself etc..... Players at the lower end.

each player who enters will fall into one of these classes.

sections are drawn containing 6 / 8 players
matches consist of 6 frames

A class player against a C class player (C class player starts on 3 frames).
A class player against a B class player (B class player starts on 2 frames).
B class player against a C class layer (C class player starts on 1 frame).

2 points for a win.
1 point for a draw.

Top player goes through to knockout.


The A class players will need to play very well to win their match or go through.
All the other players will have a chance to stay in the competiton longer.

I dont like handicaps, even tho being a Den inn player i would get a 2 frame start against all the top players from the Brig & AHW,
I'm fine with how it is now, but i would go along with any changes,
Except handicaps, if its handicaps I'm out..

ok thanks mike for your views on the jathros league , nearer the time when collecting the entry fee ill ask again and take a note of what people would like to play

and mike who won the summer league final

it is an idea to play handi cap , groups in division , and the way it is , to see what people want to play as some say it could be better, well all the ideas people come up with, are put forward so what ever idea we go for , people can not complain there idea was not brought up

whens the jathros kicking of this year stoo and have you decided what your doing with the format?

MEATHEAD wrote:whens the jathros kicking of this year stoo and have you decided what your doing with the format?

i might have said before, i'll ask everyone when i collect the league fees what format they prefer, with the league starting i'll start asking chaps if their wanting in to start maybe october

with people taking weeks even months to complete their fixtures i thought this year giving players the 2 weeks to play the fixture as normal but giving the 2 points to the home play if the fixture is not played on time, this will make the away player more likely to play
both players are still responsible for arranging the fixture

a walkover (2 points) with no frame difference for the game not played , 6-0 is a bit harsh for the win , giving some players 6-0 is helping them if the points score is the same as others at the top and getting a better frame difference for not playing,
with other players having to play the fixture and only getting a 4-2 win or draw

head to head result is ok but not to decide the league table , the best way is to decide the posisitions by frame difference between all the players as it is the jathros league
with a players head to head result over a player at the top if they end on the same points the player that won the fixture has an advantage for ever but if its frame difference that can change with good form

if the frame difference is the same then head to head will be used

ive come to this decision after 4 years holding the competition and seeing some of the problems each year , but in the end if all the players arranged and played their fixture on time it would help

just wondering if this is going ahead this year??

started the search for the 2011/12 champion

made a registration sheet for players wanting to enter this season, starting with blazers players then handed the sheet to gabs to ask his players if they wanted in this year
gonna get round the other pubs in the next few weeks

the sheet asks for information like , name , what venue you would like to play from, it does not have to be the team you play for , mobile number so you can be contacted , email address so you can get your copy of the players phone numbers and fixture list (so i dont have to print them all out) some people dont have PC's , preferred format (groups or divisions)

last years competition started on the 22 november , so as soon as we have enough players it can start

will the draw get seeded stoo?

MEATHEAD wrote:will the draw get seeded stoo?

I do like to have seeds in the draw each season, usally the qualifiers from last seasons groups but if we need more then 3rd or 4rth place could be used depending what format we play (it would have to be an overwhelming vote against the present format for there to be a change)

even though there is seeds it does not mean seeds have it easy, but they do avoid the other qualifiers from last season

if the status quo vote is won and there is enough players then i'm looking to have 8 groups of 5 or 6 players , with top 2 going through to the knockout stages (last 16) then the quarter finalists (4 losers) getting entry to next seasons league (winning £10 entry fee)
semi finals getting money with runner up and champion

this is a little different to other competitions in levenmouth with the top 8 players competing for a prize
losing a match in the league does not mean you are nocked out the competition

some would say why bother with prizes for quarter/semi finals , well it is a little different with more pressure on getting past the last 16
if we get enough players then the top prize will still be the same as last season

i've made a knockout draw before players are drawn in to groups so no complaints about getting a hard draw in the knockouts
the way the draw will be made is seeds drawn against the 8 groups 1-8 (2 seeds in each group only) , then all the other players drawn into the groups from 1 to 8

put my name down please stoo. (you get a month to play a game eh) haha